Note AI Transcript

 

In this conversation,Tony Skinner interviews Simone Robinson, a copywriter and marketing strategist. They discuss the importance of networking, the role of messaging in marketing, the impact of artificial intelligence on copywriting, and tips for starting a business.

Simone emphasises the need for clear and compelling messaging, the power of headlines, and the importance of understanding your target audience. She also highlights the value of blending AI with human expertise in copywriting. Simone shares her unique background in psychology and her experience working in high-level marketing roles, which sets her apart in the industry.

Overall, the conversation provides insights into effective copywriting and marketing strategies.

Tony Skinner (00:02.603)
Hi and welcome to the podcast channel for PodcastMyBusiness .com .au and the content channel for ContentMadeEasy .com .au and today we’re joined by Simone Robinson. Hello Simone, how are you?

Simone Robinson (00:17.136)
I’m great, thank you. Thank you very much for having me. I’m excited to meet you.

Tony Skinner (00:24.811)
Great, and look, thanks very much for taking the time. Yeah, it’s interesting. We met through a networking event online, and it just shows the value of networking events online. And I guess for you, considering where you’re located, is that a big thing that helps you a lot?

Simone Robinson (00:43.088)
Yes, absolutely. Networking has been huge, especially being able to network sort of beyond Tasmania, which, love Tasmania, fantastic place to be, but it’s great to have that extended network. Very helpful in the business.

Tony Skinner (01:00.299)
Yeah exactly, I mean I have been to Tasmania, I went on a cruise down there. I was happy to see the brewing from the Cascade Brewery bottle.

Simone Robinson (01:04.912)
great.

Simone Robinson (01:11.504)
yes? That’s great. Fantastic.

Tony Skinner (01:16.363)
Yeah, that’s cool. Alright, so how about you let us know a little bit about your business and your history there and what you do and how you help others.

Simone Robinson (01:27.632)
Yeah, absolutely, thank you.

I’m a copywriter and marketing strategist. I’ve been doing this just over a decade now. And so what I specialize in is I help businesses first and foremost really dial in their messaging. So really make sure that they are using the right language to communicate with their ideal customers. But more than that, that they’re positioning themselves as the go -to, as the expert, as the person who is going to be able to solve these problems.

And I do this through more than just dialing in your USP, it’s about telling compelling stories about what you do and why you do it. And really resonating with people that you are ideally looking to communicate with and to bring into your business and to work with on any kind of level. So that’s primarily what I do. And then that extends through to helping people with all sorts of marketing. From the emails, to the paid ads, to channel assessments.

strategy, social media, marketing, you know, I help people with it, but it all starts with that foundation of having a really great message.

Tony Skinner (02:43.243)
So what are some of the things you look for when you are looking for a message or a story?

Simone Robinson (02:52.592)
Yeah.

So a couple things, and it does depend, right? Because some people are lucky enough to have a super unique product or something that is just a little bit category of one. And so then it’s about explaining it. Otherwise, we can look at what you’re doing that is unique. So, you know, let’s take the example of a fitness coach, right? So the way that you are going to be talking to people who are men in their 30s is going to be very different to women going through menopause, for example. And the people you’re targeting

the methods you’re using, the different leverages that you are creating is going to be different. And so making sure that one, we’re clearly articulating all these sort of pieces and two, I love to look into why people got into it in the first place. And so I have a really great story that I like to tell and obviously I won’t use the client’s name but this client had been really struggling to get traction, right? They were doing a drop shipping store, fitness goods and they just, yeah.

They’ve been through a couple coaches and agencies and they just couldn’t sort of determine what was unique about them and she said to me, look Simone I’m dropshipping store, right? Like I’m not producing these products. There’s nothing unique about this. People can buy them elsewhere. I don’t really know how to position it.

And so I said, well, you know, why did you get into fitness? Right? Why is this the industry that you’re in versus, you know, any other drop shipping? She’s like, well, you know, I used to play for the Matildas. And so that was a bit of a moment of, you know, she had this really great story of playing for a national team and being a really successful athlete and then going through an injury in her recovery process. And eventually that sort of spurred her into the fitness industry.

Simone Robinson (04:42.018)
in general and wanting to bring these products to people and no one had sort of picked up on it so it’s just asking those questions and looking at you know what’s special about you why did you do it in the first place because sometimes it’s right in front of you and you don’t notice because you’re so stuck in it it’s very easy to kind of not see it

Tony Skinner (05:02.443)
Yeah, I think that’s one of the things that being able to step back and have a look from the outside or right across the board. So business sense, personal sense and at times it can take somebody else to do that for you to show you well this is what makes you different, what makes you unique. So what makes you unique Simone?

Simone Robinson (05:25.328)
what makes me unique. Now you’re putting me on the spot. I’ve got a dull in my own message. So a couple things. There’s a couple things that make me unique. So, I have a background in psychology. I actually ended up doing my degree in psychology, which…

you know, most people in the marketing, copywriting industry, the best ones are interested in psychology. But that sort of sets me apart, having that knowledge and information about how people work and how to best communicate with them has been a really great thing for me and really helps inform that. The second thing is I’ve been lucky enough through my career to work in the CMO roles, work in the marketing director roles, be in these seven and eight figure businesses, these large agencies that

you know are nationally and internationally known and have this really high -level experience that I’m now really committed to bringing to business owners who maybe aren’t looking to spend 15k plus on the agency right who aren’t maybe looking for this massive investment but they want that that skill and that background and so I take what I’ve learned in my psychology degree in my 10 years of experience in these agencies and I make it accessible

to your sole traders, your small to medium business owners, people who deserve to have quality marketing that works and a strong message that attracts the right people but they might not be looking to go with these larger organizations which not only do they come with the bigger contracts and they come with a bigger price tag but they’re a little bit more heavy in terms of who you’re communicating with, your touch points and this is not to say that there’s anything wrong with agencies, marketing agencies

agencies are great, they have overhead costs and they run a little differently. So it’s just a sort of a different way of bringing that to business owners.

Tony Skinner (07:24.963)
Yeah, there’s so many different types of businesses out there. There’s small ones, the medium and the large ones. But I like playing in the small to medium and I think it’s the same as yourself small to medium because they’re more direct. You’re dealing with the owners and if not the owners and certainly the managers that report directly to the owners rather than multiple levels. Do you think that helps as well?

Simone Robinson (07:40.048)
now.

Simone Robinson (07:46.)
absolutely, because I feel like sometimes, and again this is just how organisational structures work, but you can get stuck in the bureaucracy and in the going through three, four, five people before you get a decision and sometimes that can slow down the process and I know that I can get results quickly and you know a lot of other agencies can too, but doing it in that more direct capacity.

Tony Skinner (08:11.211)
So when you studied psychology and then you started your own business, how long ago was that?

Simone Robinson (08:18.192)
So I did it at the same time.

I took a lot on my plate. I moved to Australia. I started my degree and I started my business and that was just going on 11 years now that I decided to undertake all of that. And so when I came out of my psychology degree, I had the choice to kind of continue down that path and do my residency effectively, was what that is, that fifth year, or kind of continue on the marketing. And honestly, I have a lot of love for psychologists. It’s an incredibly important

job, an incredibly important industry, but I’d already realised that my love lay in the written word and storytelling in reaching more people than maybe I could have done just as a psychologist one on one.

Tony Skinner (09:08.043)
So talking about copywriting, yes, I use copywriters for various things, including my SEO business as well. But let’s talk about the elephant in the room when it comes to copywriters. Artificial intelligence. Or as I prefer to call it, intelligent algorithms. Yeah. Yeah. But it’s a massive, it’s a…

Simone Robinson (09:20.176)
Yes, AI. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that’s that’s very big in the industry.

Tony Skinner (09:37.707)
Yeah, no, please go ahead. How do you see that impact in the industry?

Simone Robinson (09:41.968)
yeah, so

Look, I think AI has its place. I think it’s a very useful tool. A lot of copywriters use it, especially when it comes to things like idea generation. It’s a really good tool to kind of speed up the process. The only thing is, and you know, maybe I’m a little bit biased, but I don’t feel like it’s quite at the place of fully replacing copywriters. And a lot has to do with two things, the uniqueness of the messaging and…

Structuring something in a very compelling way. So AI does a great job if you feed it the right information it can you know Put it can put something out there that is, you know, it’s certainly possible, you know, you have to check for compliance Please don’t use it for your Facebook ads It’s not it’s not there for compliance yet But you know it does It does work to support that if you’re really looking to dial in something that makes you sound Unique and stand out immediately AI has a hard time

with that because it is basing it off all of these you know marketers from the past or this writing from the past and so it does all start to sound a little bit similar and so it has its place I think it’s super useful if you’re not at the place yet you want to get a copywriter in it’s better to do that than to you know not have any copy and not be putting anything out there but if you’re really looking to kind of level up and have that really unique standpoint I feel like copywriters aren’t quite replaceable yet

Tony Skinner (11:10.923)
Yeah, and I think the key…

Yeah, and I think one of the key things is that none is it not replacing copyright is yet, but it writes terrible stuff a lot of the time. You got to rewrite it anyway.

Simone Robinson (11:26.128)
I’m glad you said it, not me. Because it makes me sound biased.

Tony Skinner (11:31.627)
No, no, well, you know, to be fair, I experiment with it and I do use it. But I don’t use ChatGP2 for a start. I use a tool for my industry that’s specific for my industry.

Simone Robinson (11:41.232)
Yes.

Simone Robinson (11:48.624)
Yeah, that helps.

Tony Skinner (11:49.451)
So that’s the first thing. And then I found another tool that goes through AI and humanizes it and it passes every single AI test. So there are ways, but again, this is time. Yeah. I can just pay someone to do it and have it done and I don’t have to worry about it.

Simone Robinson (11:57.392)
Mm -hmm.

Simone Robinson (12:04.592)
Mm.

Simone Robinson (12:09.52)
Yeah, 100%. And I mean, of course, there’s the things like you would know with SEO, right? AI, maybe, you know, maybe AI does fantastic keyword research, but I have not heard that from people in the industry. So they’re still going to always be that human element involved. So learning how to sort of blend the two. So you work with AI, I don’t think it has to be an either or sort of situation necessarily, as long as you’re using it in a way that is smart. Because it’s also not like you said, not great for SEO. There’s a lot of engines.

can pick it up.

Tony Skinner (12:43.211)
Yeah, exactly. So, you know, have a play. But, and whatever you do, double check it. Yeah, so we won’t get into that too much more. Okay, cool. So you’ve been in the business for 11 years. What are some of the tips and tricks that you’ve got that you’ve learned, say, starting up a business in the first instance?

Simone Robinson (13:03.44)
starting up a business. Yeah, got it. So network with people. I say this as I wish someone had told me this 11 years ago versus a couple years ago when I got into it. It’s been huge for my business and also for just being known and being known in the industry and getting those connections that otherwise you might not do. So don’t neglect that. So that’s probably a very big one. And the second one is also don’t

don’t neglect how important the skill set is and I say this because I see a lot of people who are in the business influencing space you know talk about starting these businesses up really quickly because they are businesses that are going to make you money and while there’s certainly a place for that if you are

obsessed with what you’re doing, you’re going to be ahead of the curve. If you love what you do and you spend time investing into it and research and becoming the go -to expert in it, it’s going to be a lot easier for the rest of our workplace rather than choosing an industry because it’s lucrative.

So obviously there’s a balance, right? You do want to choose an industry you can make a living in. But it is about also industries will become saturated. AI will jump in and try and sweep it from under you. But if you are genuinely loving what you do and you are always at the cutting edge, it’s going to be pretty hard to replace you.

Simone Robinson (14:34.256)
starting something.

Tony Skinner (14:34.827)
And that’s true, because when I do business stories, you do business stories.

Simone Robinson (14:39.696)
Mm -hmm.

Tony Skinner (14:41.643)
And we both do that. And the key thing is we’re individuals. We know the questions to ask. We know how to guide people. We know how to help them to get it done. And the right question is to ask. Artificial intelligence, or again, as I call it, intelligent algorithms, that’s really what it is, doesn’t have the capability of doing that.

Simone Robinson (14:52.816)
you

Simone Robinson (15:00.272)
Mm.

Simone Robinson (15:04.112)
Yep.

Absolutely, 100%.

And in terms of potentially what advice I would give in copywriting if we’re just going down to that more technical level.

Write 10 headlines. It’s a piece of advice I got from a senior from the writer when I was starting my career. The headline is the most important thing. If you’re trying to write a blog post, if you’re trying to write a social post or an ad or especially a sales page, write as many headlines as you can. Some of them are going to suck, but that’s the number one thing. So you should be able to attract their attention on that. Fickle people, don’t have high attention.

spans you want to really get them in that and that’s where the messaging comes in too right if you got the good message it’s going to be much easier to write that compelling headline and on headlines you should be able to understand the whole story on headlines if somebody skims your landing page your website right do they understand what you do are they compelled by just reading through those headlines just kind of skimming over is it enough to keep them interested might not be enough to close a sale but is it enough to keep them interested and keep them reading so

Simone Robinson (16:24.994)
Ultimately your job is to keep them reading and then taking action, right? Those are the two things you want to do.

Tony Skinner (16:34.283)
Anyway.

Tony Skinner (16:37.995)
We’re not talking about headlines, I just thought of a headline.

Simone Robinson (16:41.552)
is.

Tony Skinner (16:42.411)
That’s going to get straight to the point. Your headline is crap.

Simone Robinson (16:44.976)
yes? Which headline?

Tony Skinner (16:51.819)
Do you think that will get attention?

Simone Robinson (16:54.224)
Your hairline’s crap? Yes. Got my attention? I’m like, excuse me. Yeah, exactly. You got my attention, you got me worried. Yeah, 100%. See? That’s exactly what works, right? You got my attention, you hit that pain point, I’m like, excuse me, what?

Tony Skinner (16:55.947)
Now that’s the headline.

Tony Skinner (17:07.403)
See? It’s things like that. Look, I do headlines and things like that and I…

Tony Skinner (17:15.179)
I’m not paid for doing headlines but I thought that one stuck into my head. Yeah so I’d like to apologize to everyone we’re having a slightly little technical thing. The good old NBN it’s like you know sometimes we have little issues and that’s just the way life is unfortunately. Cool all right so Simone is there anything else you’d like to add?

Simone Robinson (17:30.224)
Yes.

Simone Robinson (17:39.984)
anything else I’d like to add. What I’ve already said before, right, whether you are hiring a marketer or whether you’re doing it on your own.

pay attention to your messaging, spend the most time on your messaging and on your headlines. Spend, like the things that people are going to come across first, take the time to get them right. You know, your colour scheme, your logos, your, these are important, your design elements. Even what you’re saying on your page, it’s important, but if you don’t have that clear messaging and you, and you don’t know who you’re talking to, how you’re talking to them, and why you’re talking to them, it’s just, it’s just not going to convert. So taking the time before you

worry about trying to optimize your ads or you know tweak the little things make sure that those big things are in place test the messaging see what kind of works see what people relate to ask the questions talk to your avatar your ideal customers or your current customers and just get really clear on it because it really does make the biggest impact in your marketing more than tweaking the little things long term which you know they can help but this is the big one so just making sure you’re spending the time or hiring a professional for your

can but just you know focusing on that first everything flows from there. That’s the big one.

Tony Skinner (18:58.955)
Yeah, you’re right. Okay, Simone, and do you have a website people can reach you on?

Simone Robinson (19:03.6)
yes, so it is simonrobbinson .com .au. Nice and simple.

Tony Skinner (19:11.115)
Simone with an E, so Simon with an E on the end.

Simone Robinson (19:14.692)
That’s right, yes, all one way. And Robinson.

Tony Skinner (19:20.011)
Yeah. As in Robinson Crusoe. There we go. How’s that for name association?

Simone Robinson (19:21.552)
I think.

Simone Robinson (19:25.523)
That’s what my mum always used to say when we were growing up. Robinson as in Crusoe. Ingrained.

Tony Skinner (19:33.739)
Yeah, yeah, it’s very important. Alright, thank you Simone.

Simone Robinson (19:39.472)
Thank you so much, really appreciate your time, it’s been great.